Especially on the internet. You can hardly find any discussion of any martial art at all without a mention of how good it is on da streetz. I’ve noticed some of the same morons in car culture (da street races bro), but that just doesn’t fly with actual track drivers. Not the same way as it does with martial arts, at least. Why is it like this?
Imagine if every discussion around rowing was about how effective you would be as an oarsman in an ancient Greek trireme.
>bro that technique wouldn’t work in the seas bro
>we would just go hard to port and then loop around and ram you bro
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Because a lot of martial arts have rules and street fights don't have rules so they like to make that an example of why martial arts don't work for street fights. They don't fall short on not training a specific martial art, they fall short on not fighting in general or having no experience in fighting or combative sports.
Rally is the only complete racing style. All other racing is bullshido.
>muh dirt roads
Ngmi
Trophy truck baja racing is the only real motorsport on 4 wheels
You misspelt Top Truck Challenge
>combines high speed desert running, rock crawling, and mud bogging
>codriver
>course notes
>stages they've all seen a hundred times
>no traffic
wouldn't work in a police chase
Because that's their entire purpose, go play pickleball if you want to socialize and play a game, it's much easier
You want to end up like Dillon Danis and get choked out by a random guy at a bar? Because that's what practicing for fun gets you
Your art will be sporterized and we will refer to your instructors will be called "coach". Resistance is futile.
this is good
>Turns your martial art into a safer sport.
>Nothing personal kid.
Maybe we have different definitions of "sporterizing" I see it as a way to protect against bullshido. If you never compete, then you are forced to go off of theory which can lead you to wild techniques, such as those found in taekwondo and kung fu
>never compete
>taekwondo
literally an international Olympic sport
you arent allowed to hit people with any amount of serious force in olympic taek. The mindset of "My techniques are too dangerous for the ring" is literally baked into the philosophy of that sport. As a result of them literally never sparring, they have developed outrageous and entirely uselss techniques, and their sport is more akin to jazzersize than martial arts
Which one's the one where you're allowed to actually kick people hard? I used to train taekwondo because it was offered at my judo school but I never got serious about it.
no idea, it seems to me that most serious people who want to do some form of kickboxing end up doing muay thai, and that is the only popular art/sport that lets you kick hard, besides mma/ufc that I know of
>you arent allowed to hit people with any amount of serious force in olympic taek.
You are literally allowed to kick as hard as you want. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JNAmVvHKVk
It just turns out that racking up points by only putting in minimum force and then winning by decision is better. Like boxers that just spam jabs/hugs and repeat for 30 minutes.
big differejnce between a martial art which rewards physically overpowering your opponent, and competitive dancing which favors touching your opponent better
>umm, that wouldn’t work in a hecking street fight!!!!
second thought after watching this video is that this is the most embarassing "fight" ive ever seen. If you were attempting to advocate for taekwondo, you failed horribly
"Sporterizing" is a mixed bag for me.
It may protect agains bullshido if there is some good form of free sparring/real fight and you live, like we do, in peaceful times.
The drawback is that sport has to be safe and is specialized wich leads to some tunnel vision training and elimination of the more "dangerous moves"(for an opponent).
Kano is a example of why martial arts worked in the old days and were transformed to less violent times. He took jujutsu, traditional jujutsu, mastered it, teached it and defeated other styles with it and at the same time or a little after he added a philosophy, rule set and discarded the more dangerous moves out of free sparring and sport.
If he saw the practice of judo today he would probably think only a fraction of his sport is taught and that the martial art he mastered was way more effective for pure violence.
For one, a lot of people get into martial arts because they’re worried that they wouldn’t be able to protect themselves in a street fight. The people who stay long term usually grow out of this but the kind of people who talk about da streetz on the internet are autistic and don’t mature. The other issue at play is that you have non-competitive shitters who think “well maybe I can’t beat you in mma but I’d totally wreck you on the streetz”. Essentially, it’s a fricking cope to avoid putting the effort in to training for real.
Martial arts are unique in that rank beginners with no physical fitness think they can beat experienced players. No other sport has this.
It's also unique in that the souped up miata thinks it can trade paint with a shit box semi.
I literally do believe this. I'mma go find an MMA gym somewhere to see if I'm right. I bet I would whup their asses.
Is every sport with a ball a martial art then? I can't remember a time when a fatass beer gut wasn't telling everyone how they would have personally done it at Rugby/football/cricket.
guys don't want to appear as sissies by admitting they'd lose in a fight, simple as
I bring it up because while I do appreciate the effort and work ethic that goes into an athletic performance, it seems more useful to me that we make sure to keep the practice of martial arts practical. There is no practical reason for having mma competitions, UNLESS it's purpose is to test your skills in an "actual fight" however, sport rules are still needed to keep the practice sustainable. No one would step into the ring if they could get stomped in the head and die
>No one would step into the ring if they could get stomped in the head and die
>KOTS
>early UFC
>90s Vale Tudo
>Pride
>No one would step into the ring if they could get stomped in the head and die
*Stomps Japanese tomato cans in your path*
... because that's what martial arts are about? Why else would you train martial arts for?
I guess you'd become more agile and healthy in general. And it teaches kids discipline and some values. You don't have to learn a martial art to fight
Martial arts is about discipline and character development, not street fighting.
>martial
Literally means 'military'. It's meant to be a form of combat skill for an era before firearms were widespread. It didn't become a performance art until the 19th century.
Literally every time a style has come to popularity beyond aristocracy in any culture has been because of street fighting
It has two very different reasons:
1: We came from the 90s "Asian Martial Arts turn you into a killing machine!" to todays scepticism. Most MA have been debunked as half-useful to completely useless. Aikido was revered to a godlike art and is now a joke, Wing Chun never worked, most kung fu practitioners get easily beaten by someone with 6 months in Boxing. Also most western arts like Boxing, Kickboxing and (old school) wrestling turned out to be way more effective than anyone thought, since most looked down on them as the "sport Arts" instead of "fighting Arts".
The emergence of MMA an similar stuff showed the world what really works and what does not in a one on one fight. But it also created a new problem: Arts that only perform in the ring, like BJJ. BJJ is the killer in the ring but you don't have to search long to find all kind of videos where a guy uses BJJ on "Tha Streetz" and get his skull kicked like a football by the other guys friend. So now everyone is discussing what arts will actually work on a street scenario, which was always kind of the point of martial arts.
2, The world is turning to shit and violence becomes more common, so more people are asking the question which martial art they should train to actually be able to defend themselves or others (or if the martial art they already train can actually defend them). The 'murrika answer of "Just use a gun" does not really help since you will not be able to deploy a gun in time if someone tries to suckerpunch you. Also you have gun free zones and, well, europe, where you never even get a permit to carry a gun for selfprotection.
All in all I still think it is a healthy obsession because it grounds the discussion in reality. Just look at fencing, it is turning more and more irrelevant because all they care about is to sportify it with every rule change even more. And since its now even loosing its semblance to anything looking like a swordfight HEMA is replacing it rapidly in attendance.
Both of your reasons are memes.
1. muh UFC gave us a reality check... those guys in the early UFCs were hand-picked to be not a danger to the Gracie brand. They were hardened criminals, street fighters and thugs, do you really think they never had any experience with ground fighting? Scratch that, with America's obsession with wrestling and kids being kids and roughhousing, playing pro wrestling etc. do you really think they didn't have a clue about ground fighting?
There's a reason the first wave of MMA fans were unathletic dorks who had never balled a fist in their lives and whose experience in personal conflicts was about debating Christians online, which also explains the ego-tripping US/Euro MMA culture. BJJ/MMA was their Randi Challenge.
Back in the 80s everyone knew that karate > boxing, just like everyone knows today that karate < boxing, but back then people actually still fought every weekened.
Not saying asian arts are good, but there's more to this subject than "nobody ever fought until the late 90s".
2. Violence is becoming more common because nonwhites attack whites and whites don't defend themselves. With such a mindset, it doesn't matter what martial art you do, you will always lose. Our culture need to quickly re-inject violence.
>and whites don't defend themselves.
/misc/ tier garbage meme.
>how to immediately tell someone is untrained
they shit on BJJ and bring up the same imaginary scenario streetz fight scenario. It's always the same dorks that like to intellectualize with made up scenarios deduce it from logic despite being untrained and don't understand shit. Literally everyone except the gracie koolaid drinkers and noobs knows to not do bjj in a multiple fight encounter and not to play guard in da streetz and to get on top STAY there and end it there or on the back.
>But muh takedowns
if you take a guy training for mma/self defense the idea they can't takedown someone untrained without massive attribute discrepancy is silly. Another trait of untrained noobs is they keep taking the same caricature of this bjj guy that only plays bottom. Yes they exist but if they are any good they are purposely training for sport purposes, AKA FUN and COMPETITION. The untrained dork can't even fathom this. They really think the only reason to ever do a martial art is for self defense
>The 'murrika answer of "Just use a gun" does not really help since you will not be able to deploy a gun in time if someone tries to suckerpunch you.
Bullshit. Even if you get punched, you take it and draw, If you get thrown on your back you draw from the ground. If you get knocked the frick out, then nothing would have helped you anyways, but proper gun training negates any fighter's threat in 95% of scenarios. Still, in a world where weakness is extremely widespread I think sucker punches that do real damage are a meme.
>Also you have gun free zones
The few places that are real, actual Gun free zones are places that are heavily guarded by law enforcement.
>and, well, europe, where you never even get a permit to carry a gun for selfprotection.
Frick Europe. Brought them on themselves.
Become? It has been like that since day one. Martial Arts are just refined techniques that came from a time where wars and unrest were far more common than they are now. Then came the rules, to make them a sport but only a moron can't realize how rules martialize when sparring and how those same rules become null in a street fight. All grapplers at some point when sparring realize "huh, from here on a real fight I can punch him/blind him/etc". I don't even have to exemplify striking arts because that's just basically "keep going after the oponent throws the towel or is knocked out". Learning, sparring and competing under rules don't instantely make you a moron that waits for a bell on a ghetto alley.
With all that said, anon, my blackest Black, if you are so fricking annoyed by these conversations that you can't focus on the actual discussions everyone has about technique or whatever, then just fricking ignore it or don't participate in them and maybe then we will see martial arts as a sport and art only. Because people discussing whether a MA is good on da streetz or not has 0 repercussions on your life or your skills in that MA. YOU are the one making it an issue.
>YOU are the one making it an issue.
No Black person. I’m not.
Whenever you make a post about ANYTHING martial arts related, literally ANYTHING, there are dipshits like (YOU) who insert themselves into the conversation and say
>buh MUH STREETZ
>buh MUH GUNZ
>buh MUH EYE GOUGE
>buh MUH TOO DANGEROUS FOR LE RING
Frick off. I do not want your kind shitting up everything anymore. There are no “actual discussions about technique” because moronic chimps cannot help themselves from going where they don’t belong.
Kek, nice argument gay. Literally a whole post wasted by reddit spacing and seething. Just have a nice day.
Oh, and enjoy being isolated from the MA community just because people talk about something you find annoying, like the 80iq subhuman you evidently are.
>BUH MUH MA COMMUNITY
Get the frick out newbie. Dipshits who don’t train aren’t part of the “community”.
>reddit spacing
where?
>Bullshit. Even if you get punched, you take it and draw, If you get thrown on your back you draw from the ground. If you get knocked the frick out, then nothing would have helped you anyways, but proper gun training negates any fighter's threat in 95% of scenarios. Still, in a world where weakness is extremely widespread I think sucker punches that do real damage are a meme.
>Someone wants to punch you? Just shoot'em lol!!!
Self-defense is legitimate is the force you oppose to the aggressor is somewhat relative. If someone wants to beat you up using their fists and you shot them dead then you're gonna spend at the very least 10 years in prison.
So, 10 years of prison or 6 months to a year of boxing so you can actually handle yourself in a fist fight? There's no debate here.
>If someone wants to beat you up using their fists and you shot them dead then you're gonna spend at the very least 10 years in prison.
Depends entirely on the jurisdiction. In sane places you're not legally obligated to engage in fisticuffs with any thug who decides attack you. You don't know his intentions, you don't know if he's going to pull a weapon, you just know that he's violently violated social and legal norms and has put you at risk of injury and death.
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You need to know how to fight. Having a gun does not negate that.
>TMA turned out to be bullshit
True.
>Also most western arts like Boxing, Kickboxing and (old school) wrestling turned out to be way more effective than anyone thought
This never happened.
You can find martial art challenge matches between boxing vs wrestling, wrestling vs judo/jiujitsu, etc. going back to the early 1900s and beyond. Even at the height of oriental fascination/fetishism, boxing was still the biggest combat sport in the world.
it's pretty wild how boxing and wrestling have been around for thousands of years but people call shit like tae kwon do a "traditional martial art" even though it wasn't created until 1952
shit, brazilian jiujitsu predates karate by over two decades
it's such a bullshit meaningless term
basically it's everything I don't like = TMA
everything I like = modern effective fighting style
I agree with what you said and age of a martial arts usually means nothing, but I think you got this detail wrong
>brazilian jiujitsu predates karate by over two decades
As Brazilian jiu-jitsu was initially developed in 1925 and karate is older than that. I mean, just one example:
"In 1901, Itosu helped to get karate introduced into Okinawa's public schools. These forms were taught to children at the elementary school level. Itosu's influence in karate is broad. The forms he created are common across nearly all styles of karate."
>In 1901, Itosu helped to get karate introduced into Okinawa's public schools
impossible, it wasn't until the 30s that karate was formalized and turned to shit by that cuck funakoshi acting as an unelected representative of okinawa
there were traditional okinawan martial arts, but karate was made at the behest of japan and gutted everything that made those martial arts special in the first place
Funakoshi only formalized one karate style, with the help of his son Gigo and Nakayama into what is now the most practiced form of karate and the main representative of japanese karate.
Funakoshi himself recogniced that the karate he developed was not the one he was taugth.
But still karate was used as a term for the a certain okinawan martial art before. Even the current form of karate (using"empty hand" instead of "chinese hand") as a term is predates Funakoshi as, for example, the book "Karate Kumite" was written by Chomosexual Hanashiro in 1905 and it is a textbook for the purpose of teaching karate kumite in Okinawa schools.
There are many lineages of karate that were born without any Funakoshi influence and stayed in Okinawa.
Using the same example neither Chomosexual or any of Chomo's notable disciples learned under Funakoshi and all stayed teaching their karate in Okinawa.
>get his skull kicked like a football by the other guys friend. So now everyone is discussing what arts will actually work on a street scenario
The simple answer is: none. The very second it becomes a 1v2+ the singular person is pretty much fricked no matter training. Trying to find some unicorn martial art that will magically let you fight off multiple opponents at the same time is moronic.
>You can hardly find any discussion of any martial art at all without a mention of how good it is on da streetz.
It's mainly because the vast majority of people have never been in an actual fight, nor seriously trained any martial art, but still want to feel superior and be seen as a tough guy. You get the same shit from people who title themselves "undefeated street fighters." It's all tough guys who don't know how any of it works that want to explain away why they don't train, but are still badasses on par with John Wick.
Become nowadays, most western countries are filled with Black folk and sandBlack folk who would harass you 1v9 just for a bad glance, so the effectiveness of a martial art is detrimental.
Of course you can practice a martial art specifically for sports or aesthetics purposes, but most of us want it to work.
Because nowadays*
Try that in a small town
>arm is crippled
>unathletic
Ay yo I'm just bringing a knife when I go out walking.
I'd bring a gun but I can't afford that shit.
And nobody would convict a cripple for knifing someone up in self defense.
>I'm just carrying a shitty martial tool as a Talisman of Safety instead of training a martial art and learning how to deploy it effectively
Looks like your brain is crippled, too.
> Too poo-poo to afford a glockerino.
street fights sell
I think comparing it to a street fight is a valid point, we have to get our martial arts in check so they don't become Tai Chi or Aikido.
I do BJJ and I have in mind the weakness of the sport, weak takedowns and takedown defense and other things. I feel If we recognize it we are fine, but then you have diluted ppl that think they can defeat a pro fighter with their Aikido
everything that goes mainstream loses its essence in an awfull shit show
there are tons and tons and tons of vids of well trained fighters smashing the shit out of noobs ... this happens everysingle day in the gym as well but ppl don't film pros against begginers because there is nothing to gain from that
You only need to know that if a guy has a competitive background in martial arts you can take him seriously, if not he doesn't know shit, it is just as simple
Also, fight became a Black person sport, thats the reason for all this clownery
Men find street fighting inherently cool but very few people actually have access to street fights.
As such they try to do a fighting substitute in the only place where they have access to it. I.e combat sports gym. This is the mentality of most MMa/BJJ/MT guys. If jujitsu wasn't advertised as helping you in a fight, it would be some weird hobby like fencing or stamp collecting.
Therefore it makes a lot of sense why these people are quite mad when you tell them that them humping another man's wiener for the last 4 years doesn't actually resemble fighting.